April 25, 2007

  • The Church and I: Got Jesus?

    Ok, I came up with 20 post ideas like that (snaps fingers), so I think I'll ride this topic out until late summer, and then maybe close down the blog. We'll see. But before I get started, let's check ourselves. We're going to be talking about a lot of concepts that are found in the epistles, about how to act in a church, how a church should govern itself, what types of people are in church, etc. But first, do you love the Jesus of the gospels? Or are you  so intrigued by issues of finding the ideal church, or creating the best ministry, or interpreting the Bible that you have let those issues obscure the face of Christ? I have. And if you have too, let's consider that and get our priorities in order before starting the series officially. The church is simply a mechanism by which believers in the Lord Jesus grow in him and worship him; to idealize it is a sure ticket to falling away and backslidding when it disappoints you. Only Jesus is promised never to leave or forsake us.

    No disrespect meant by using the Got Jesus play on the Got Milk commercials, ha. Jesus is the milk, cookies, and the entire meal.

Comments (12)

  • if the church is a mechanism, the bible is a mechanism. just trying to get on the same page.

    that would be the jesus page.

    and what does a jesus mustache look like?

  • Thank you. That's what I've been feeling for a long time - to love Jesus is first, the rest fallows naturally. I'm really tired of all the pointless theological debates - debates answer no real questions, after all. In all honesty, I think we (the universal we of generalities, of course) like to hide our hearts behind theology. If we truly let ourselves go then we'd have a real issue, wouldn't we. Suddenly, we'd have to do something and we'd have to change as the love of Christ has the tendency to cause. I for one am afraid of change - not because I don't love Jesus but because I love me more.

    I like how that topic is the very thing God's been speaking to me about lately. Life is interesting, isn't it.

  • Is this a "Seek ye first the kingdom of God?" sort of thing?

  • Amen.

  • There is an "ideal" church in the epistles. She is the bride, unfaithful, but the bride none the less. Christ is the bridegroom. And so I'm not sure if the ideal church can obscure Christ. I guess that depends on what your definition of Church/the church is.

    Dunno about you, but I'm a part of the Church. May we all be keeping our wicks trimmed.

  • RYC: Sure, let me explain. In reading Paul's epistles, one can become so obsessed about different church struggles and doctrines and heresies that one forgets that the church is the bride of Christ. And quite honestly, the bride of Christ metaphor for the church is very much that of Revelations and not the epistles. The epistles instead refer to the church as the body of Christ, with the slight exception of Ephesians 4. An important difference, I believe; yes, outside of time, in heaven, the church is the bride of Christ, but in the day-to-day world of the epistles, the church is instead his body. That body is sanctified, but not glorified.

  • RYC to ChrisRusso: eh, kind of. But there again is the problem; what is the kingdom of God? Is it about organizations and plans? Or is it about following the instructions of King Jesus?

  • John - I'm interested to see your posts on these ideas.  I think the church is often criticised for it's imperfections...people expect the church to perfectly meet it's needs and when it doesn't they use that excuse to no attend a church.  It's sad...strip away the programs, worship services, ministries, welcome committees, etc and the one thing that must remain is Christ...that is the cornerstone.  I know last year I became very disillusioned with the church...noticing and being angry at the imperfections I saw around me, but I also had to come to the point where I had to throw those judgements out the window and find Christ all over again.  When our focus realigns from the imperfections in the church and onto God himself we are able to grow.

    oh yeah, and your comment made me think of a question...it's on my site under the comments.  Please read and respond

  • It would help this discussion greatly if we translate out of Christianese. The church is the ekklesia, the assembly or gathering. Essentially, the people. The kingdom is where God's will is done. ("The kingdom of God is the range of God's effective will, where what God wants done is done." --Dallas Willard.)

    So if the people are doing His will, the church is in the Kingdom. And when they aren't, presumably, they get messed up in these vain "organizations and plans," yes? Too much emphasis on building projects and fundraisers and the color of the sanctuary hall carpet?

    This Christianity thing is about being a disciple. Forget the Christianese idea of "disciple" and think more like kung fu movies--Jesus is Master Po and we are "grasshopper." Like, apprentice. We're supposed to be sitting at the feet of Jesus, Mary-style, whenever we can. That's how I believe we're supposed to approach the gospels.

  • LOL, it is funny how we respond realistically to dreams. Everytime it happens, I can't help but laugh at myself. I caught myself reciting stats info a couple of weeks ago. I did finally catch on to what we were learning in class so I guess it's not all bad :)

  • sure, you may link to the snake story if you like

  • ^kudos to russo

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