November 9, 2011

  • Are Same Gender Friendships Broken?

    I was thinking the other day about how far the typical male friendship has fallen in society. It seems that in the past, male friendships with males were valued much more highly than they are today. You have these great historical friendships like Lincoln and Speed where you see a closer level of bonding than what we typically see today. Nowadays, guys seem afraid of getting too close to each other. If you're a guy, when, if ever, did you ever tell a guy friend that you appreciated him, or even loved him? Have you ever cried around a guy friend? Or told him about problems with your family?

    It seems like male friendships are hindered by a sort of homophobia. (Yes, if you haven't noticed, this post is going to be controversial). That guys fear appearing weak, or in any way gay, so they go out of their way not to seem too eager for friendships with other guys, or to do anything at all that could be construed as gay. This means that sensitive guys often desert their friendships with guys altogether, and just connect with women instead. Essentially, these guys feel they can't depend on their own gender for anything deeper than chicken wings and football games. It's sad when you think about it. It's sad that a hug or handshake between two guys is so easily construed to be something erotic; since when is touch by itself an erotic act?

    But then, I think about the typical female friendship, and I wonder if that shows the opposite problem. Imagine, if you will, that you were reading the conversation between two female friends, Susan and "Chris", and you didn't know Chris was a girl. Isn't it odd how often, the comments you hear sound almost like something two lovers would say to each other? Chris tells Susan she has an amazing body, offers to cuddle with her, or tells her that she is hot stuff. Isn't it odd how the typical female friendship seems to have such a high degree of sexuality, objectification, envy, and/or idealization?

    I admit I don't claim to have the same insight on female friendships that I have on male friendships, given (checks pants) my  lack of female parts. But allow me to speculate before those of you with the proper parts help me understand. If male friendships are too homophobic, it seems like female friendships become too much of a sexual refuge. I understand that it's a tough world out there, and a woman needs to reassure her friends and be reassured.

    But I feel like the sexual factor adds extra stress to female relationships. Knowing that your friends are your friends just because you look hot, or because you suck up to them by telling them how hot they are...ladies, isn't it unhealthy in the end? I'm amazed by how many Xangan females have told me or blogged that they don't like having female friends. There seems to be this unnatural, unfair pressure put on a female friend. A female friend has to be friend, life coach, therapist, sex consultant, and all these additional roles...and I wonder, isn't it too much? I'm not going to take this thought too far. I'll avoid speculation as to the origins of lesbianism, given that science itself doesn't seem to be able to clearly make up its mind. But...quite honestly, I feel like the female friendship model is also broken, as females rely on their friends to supply what a lover, father, or family should be giving them. If men don't rely on other men enough, then women perhaps overdepend on other women.

    In both cases, I think 21st century friendship is terribly broken, and explains why so many people look to friendships with the opposite gender. Ask older folk, and they'll tell you they find this odd, how so many men and women spend this close time as friends nowadays and yet claim not to be lovers. But it's easy to see why it happens, right? Yes, platonic friendships have their own challenges, as these scars on my heart show (strikes melodramatic pose). But given how badly flawed and broken same-gender friendships are, I think to some extent we're forced to cross gender barriers because our own gender lets us down and fails to allow us to have proper friendships based on mutual admiration without idealization.

    I said it was going to be controversial. I hope this inspires you to write your own post. Ok, back to my Xanga Exile I go, see you in a month or something. Thoughts?

Comments (20)

  • I feel like straight guy friends either drift because of slight homophobia or they just make joking homosexual remarks to each other to ease the uncomfortableness they might feel... defense mechanisms! haha

  • Want a hug, bro?

  • Idk maybe it's not the same in my country, I've seen people stare at my siblins when they kiss eachother or my dad on the cheek, we have close friendship but that's because we have been raised that way. And my daughter's best friend is my best friend's daughter but also my best friend is the daughter of one of my mom's freinds, we consider some of our friends like family and yeah physical closeness it's not that common anymore but my brothers remain friends in the classic brotherhood way with a group of guys we've known forever.

  • Nail -
    Hammer -
    Hit -

    Wonderful! I have had similar thoughts myself, and I confess that often in my own writing (novels, short stories, etc) I get odd looks from people from time to time when let's say a "male" character breaks down on a friend... or if there seems to be some odd tension in the room between two male characters (For instace during the scene at the end of The Community with Jarron and Riley where Jarron goes to lay down on the bed and Riley is "checking him out" for lack of better term although that's not what's happening at all)...

    I've been told that I write men very well and yet, I always get that "eyebrow" when I write two men (even if they're brothers) very close. As if they think that they're going to start making out or something O_o... WHAT?!?! (Okay, admitedly this COULD be expected of a few characters in a FEW minor instances hahaha)

    But I've thought about this a lot recently... What happened to male relationships? O_o... Men used to hug, walk together, talk about all manner of glorious things, and even on occasion (GASP) say, "I love you/your friendship" and kiss one another's cheek depending on how radical the circumstance and hardly anyone said "gay" about it... Because it was NORMAL... and to be entirely honest... I believe it's also "NECESSARY"... There is really nothing "unmanly" for instance about "cuddling." (Everyone gasps...) I know two young men (18ish) who were recently in my company who spent MOST of the week wrestling, and growling and grunting... but you KNEW that they were very close because at one point, both were tired early morning and you could spot them in a corner resting on one another's shoulders not thinking "gay" about it. - I heard a few weeks later his mother comment "Yeah, they sat at the table and spoke to one another until 3AM" - SPOKE!?!? Not played video games? Not grunted at the TV?

    I believe that this particular kind of friendship helps these two men in ways indescribable. They both have the same conditions which also helps to grow their friendship.(Jesus/John anyone?) It drives me mad that people NOW days claim that David and Jonathon's relationships or Jesus and John were "gay"... 9_9...no, they weren't. They simply didn't have the stigma that we all do now days.

    It seems that as a society, we have become SO scared of "touch"/"intimacy"/"Hugging"/"cuddling" whatever it is on BOTH sides that we fear that everyone will judge us GAY or something...

    Women ? That's a whole other issue entirely... While yes, a woman plays MANY roles in a woman/woman friendship, women are a LOT more sinister than men, and from a WOMAN'S POV... women can be more deeply hurt by another woman than EVER by another man. Men don't often "plot" to "mentally ruin" a woman... While women compete, seek revenge, put down, play mental games, etc... Men are a lot less complicated than this (USUALLY, everything that I'm saying is "as a general rule) -

    Okay, this is a novel now. Forgive me.

    Great thoughts.

  • I think friendships in general are broken. People expect too much, don't give enough in return, are judgmental and tend to have a self-serving agenda. I just try to be the kind of friend I want to have, but apparently I want a lot so it doesn't always work out. I guess there is a high degree of emotional dependence these days. Everything seems so uncertain now.

  • I think I parshally agree...especially with guys having guy friends. They pretty much only talk about sports and how that chick is on the other side of the room. That being said (maybe i'm just lucky here) all of my female friends are wonderful. 

  • You make a lot of good points here. I have always preferred male friendships, but my longest lasting friendships have been with females (and my brothers, but that's a different situation, ha). In my case, the whole platonic friendship never seemed to work out, which is another topic in itself, but I definitely see what you're saying.

  • I don't have time to comment everything, so I will just write about one part that stuck out to me, the scenario with the women- saying they are hot, and offering to cuddle. I don't think that there is always a degree of sexuality to female friendships. I have never, ever had a female friend, not even lesbian female friends, offer to cuddle with me. I've had friends hug me, or hold my hand when upset, but it wasn't sexual at all. The compliments thing- I don't really see that as sexual either. I think women in general are more comfortable complimenting people. If I tell a friend that she's looking good... that's really all I mean, I don't mean that I'm ogling her.

    I can't help thinking that perhaps the same thing that drives male friendships to be so anti-sexual is also driving your perception of female friendships as over-sexualized. That thing is hyper-awareness of sexuality- what I'm saying is, you being conscious that to reach out and hold a male friend's hand might be construed as "gay", might lead you to the conclusion that women friends holding hands is slightly sexual.

    Hope I made sense. :)

  • @WaitingToShrug - You might be right, and I think you made sense. I know I wouldn't have written that second-half 2 years ago, or even 1 year ago. But lately, I'm a bit puzzled and taken aback by the amount of sexuality that I see in female friendships. For example, suppose a female posts a photo of herself looking nice on Xanga. 3 years ago, I wouldn't see many females commenting on that post, or the compliments would be more generic. But now, seems like there's a lot more aggressive comments from one female to another. I may be over-reacting, and it may be either lesbians or a few frequent posters who are biasing my observations. But it does seem like there is a sudden increase in this. Thanks for your comment.
    @LKJSlain - I was going to touch on the competitive aspect of female friendships. Sometimes this goes unnoticed by men, but it amazes me how much tension can exist in this way. Good point! Also, your writing shows an unfortunate truth--people tend to believe that closeness between two characters is a presage of sexual activity. BUT IT DOES NOT ALWAYS WORK THAT WAY, ha, and it's sad that we think that way. Good comment--I do enjoy a good long comment Feel free to write a post too if you want.

  • "since when is touch by itself an erotic act?"
    I'll answer that... Since 'gay' (i.e., homosexuality) was normalized and made to be acceptable.

  • @JstNotherDay - and the opposite reaction is even more pronounced. everything is at an extreme these days. 

    Greek- female/female friendships are different than male/male friendships....we value and talk about different things, in different ways, and draw different conclusions. sometimes it's hard to have girlfriends who you know are going to analyze everything you've told them. guys don't think as much about it, or simply don't voice what they've thought. less stress. personally, i tend to seek approval from females more than i do from guys, which makes guys easier to be around most of the time. 

  • Whoa, good food for thought.

  • clearly the only viable solution is to avoid friendships and people altogether

    seriously though, i've never thought of the girl part of this! i can't really say that my friendships with other females sound like that. i have noticed what you said about guys though.

  • I agree that a relationship between two women is much more complex than that between two guys. You do have to wear many hats in those relationships.  However, the rest of this post I have to say I disagree. In my experience, I have actually seen male relationships become more open and more emotional than I have seen in the past. I've seen my boyfriends friends openly say how much they appreciate each other. I see them shake hands or even hug when we are parting ways. 

    For women, I don't always see the compliments as being unhealthy. Obviously I can't speak for every relationship out there but I can speak for the friendships I have. I have a friend who will find something to compliment every time we see each other. Whether it's the shirt you are wearing, the bracelet, the coat or she will tell you how kind/funny/smart you are. She has used the word "sexy" when describing her female friends. It's meant to be a compliment. I know it's not that she finds the person sexy, it's a way to make them feel good. (Women tend to be more receptive to outright compliments). 
    Although I don't fully agree, this is a great post because it made me think! Awesome job as usual.

  • now this is an interesting post, and I agree with you that the macho attitude of men these days promoted a more conservative and suppressed relationship... it has relegated male friendships to boasting of conquests and petty small talks... but then, I noticed, bisexuality is also on the rise, which means that men-men sexual relationships are becoming more open and in a way, popular... perhaps, this adds more to the insecurities of alpha males when it comes to creating a much deeper relationship with other men, afraid that they be mistaken for something else... bwahahahaha

  • oh, enjoy your month-long hiatus :D  

  • Are 21st century friendships broken? I guess I’m lucky in that I don’t see it that way.  I have both guy and girl friends. But my best friends (aside from my boyfriend) are all women. And it’s not like I only have one or two.  I have a lot. And no we don’t spend a lot of time complimenting each other’s physical appearance. ;) We talk about everything from religion and politics, to fun topics like travel and music, to personal, emotional issues. They are my confidants and have been in some cases for nearly decades. (I’m 26, so I’ve grown up with some of these girls.)  
     
    I also have close guy friends but I’m not as close with them as my girlfriends. I noticed some of them have lots a friends who are girls. And some of them have confided in me that they feel comfortable talking to me about more serious, emotional stuff because I am a woman.  But quite a few of them have great guy friends who I’m sure they confide in.  But I can’t really speak well to this because I do not really know the inner workings of a male and male friendship!
     
    And yes there are girls who are mostly friends with guys. Maybe it’s because they just happened to meet more guys with similar interests, which is perfectly cool in my opinion! Sometimes you find yourself connecting with a person regardless of gender.  Although I will tell you that in cases where a girl brags that she’s only friends with guys because other girls are “catty” I would probably stay far, far, far away from her.  I have found that often times a girl that claims she’s above her fellow “catty” females is often either a.) confident and catty herself ; she doesn’t like what she perceives to be “competition” and creates drama that she blames on other women. Or b.) has low self esteem and doesn’t like having other women around, normally making disparaging remarks when other girls display stereotypical “feminine” interests, like fashion or makeup! Obviously stereotypical male interests like burping and beer are better! I have met women like that, but thankfully very few.
     
    Sure there are bad friendships. I think we hear more about bad friendships, or people are more likely to complain about bad friendships/inability to connect with their own gender because people seem to be more interested in negative news than positive.  Perhaps people just don’t like to hear others brag about how awesome their friendships are! ;)

  • None of my female friendships were like that, but I think it's because most of my best friends have been male? Although my female friend did give me my first hickey, so maybe you are right.

  • I hear ya in many respects. Ive often been dismayed for men especially in our culture

    I have a male best friend, who is like a brother to me,
    but my others are female; they keep me accountable and are so vital-- they are my sisters. :D
    Prior i always had female close friends, but probably moreso having to do with my past history.

  • I have always thought that it was strange when a female says that they never get along with other females. I seem to make female friends as often as I make male friends. I will say that my friendships with females are usually MUCH closer than with males. There are just some things that I would never tell a man. I don't think there are ever been a sexual factor in any of my female friendships though. Although my best friend (female) and I are (well were since she now lives four hours away) extremely close and we sometimes joke that people will think we are lesbians. Great blog, very thought provoking. 

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